[BYOO]Main Ops:- AJAX Mode - List Ogres - List Gear - Ciscos? - Countersheet - Back to Ogre... Ogre models and equipment which are SJG-official are styled like this. Others are fan-contributed material. Ogre® is a registered Ogre is a registered trademark of Steve Jackson Games. This material is used here in accordance with the SJ Games online policy. | BYOO: CiscosCiscos and Victory Points (VP)This toolset uses "Ciscos" as a victory point value, rather than SJG point values. There is no official SJG algorithm for assigning point values to Ogres - the official VP values were assigned based on hundreds of playtest sessions. The Cisco method, named after its creator, Francisco "Cisco" Cestero, is a very simple algorithm for determining approximate Ogre point values. It produces results close to the published VP values for official SJG Ogre models, but is *much* simpler than the Henry Cobb algorithm.The algorithm for calculating the Cisco value of an Ogre is: ( (2 * Treads) + (Total VP of all Gear) ) * 5.357 / (10 - (Ogre's MP))The VP of "gear" (weapons and accessories) is listed in the Gear table of the database, and were apparently derived from old calculations by Cisco himself. In any case, they differ from SJG VP. To convert Ciscos to Armor Unit Equivalents, simply divide by 10. To convert them to SJG VPs, multiply the Ciscos value by 0.6. Using this algorithm, we get values pretty close to those published by SJG. For example:
Model SJG VP(*) Cisco VP(**)
Mark I 25 28
Mark II 50 57
Mark III 100 98
Mark IIIb 120 123
Fencer 125(***) 132
Fencer-B 150(***) 140
Mark IV 150 162
Mark V 150 162
(*) = Source: Ogre Miniatures Rulebook
(**) = Source: the above algorithm applied to data from our DB.
(***) = The "Ogre Minitatures Update" revised the Fencer from 140
to 125 VP and presents the Fencer-B with 150VP.
The Cobb algorithm gets much closer to the SJ-published values, but
(A) it's *much* more complicated and (B) the published values are
based off of hundreds of playtest hours, not an algorithm. The Cobb
algorithm used to be available on the internet in the form of a
JavaScript application, but i can find no current link to it. It is
available in
The Ogre Book,
published by SJG (and available as a PDF from their online shop).
The Cobb forumula can be applied to non-Ogre units, whereas
the Cisco method cannot.
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